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A Million Little Things is an ABC drama series that explores various mental health topics, primarily suicide, depression, and grief. In this podcast episode, Marc Lehman sits down with the show’s creator, DJ Nash, to talk about this series’ inception and production. Marc shares how losing a real friend to suicide and dealing with anxiety inspired him to create a show centered on mental health issues. DJ Nash also discusses how the COVID-19 pandemic changed young people’s perspective on mental health, the importance of being a good friend to yourself, and how to reach out to those struggling with inner battles.

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Watch the episode here

 

Listen to the podcast here

 

A Show About Mental Health With DJ Nash

Introduction

Welcome to the show. The show that talks openly about mental health and wellness. I am so super excited to welcome in DJ Nash. I’m going to intro DJ and then we will chat openly about lots of different things. DJ is an individual after graduating from Brown University headed to Manhattan to begin his career doing stand-up. In 2000 was named Best New Face at the Montreal Just for Laughs Comedy Festival, which led to a deal with CBS where he co-created and starred in a CBS pilot, “Life with David J” along with Elliot Gould.

Nash has been writing and not acting ever since. In 2014 an executive produced the NBC series, “Growing Up Fisher.” The show was based on Nash’s childhood. Growing up with a father who is blind and with parents who got divorced. The show featured the first visually impaired lead actor in a comedy series, as well as the first guide dog. In 2018, DJ produced and wrote an amazing show called “A Million Little Things.” I have to say, by far and away, my favorite show. Love the saying that the show starts off with, “Friendship isn’t a big thing, it’s a million little things.”

If you haven’t watched this show, please make the time. It’s absolutely phenomenal. This show is loosely based on Nash’s real-life experiences. A Million Little Things is an hour-long dramedy which ran for five seasons on ABC and is now available on Hulu. A Million Little Things touched upon some really important topics. Suicide, disability, divorce, the courage to come out in high school, sexual abuse, the weight of the coronavirus, and the tensions that arose from the death of George Floyd. A million little things pushed us to reconsider how we treat each other.

What an amazing topic. Because of A Million Little Things, DJs become very involved with mental health and the mental health community serving as ambassador on PREVENTS alongside the head of every branch of the armed forces on a presidential task force aimed at reducing the suicide rate among veterans. He’s also very active with the American Foundation for Suicide Prevention with DiDi Hirsch in L.A. Currently, DJ is developing a series for NBC and one for Hulu. He’s also making a documentary called Joy about a survivor of child sexual assault and her inspiring story of resilience.

 

 

DJ, welcome.

Thank you so much. Those are all the things I did that seemed to work. I could do the ones where I failed miserably. We could fill the whole hour.

You’ve done a lot as I mentioned to you before we started chatting. Your show is just amazing. Absolutely amazing. I would just say as a therapist, having worked with so many people with mental health issues resonated deeply with me, and every single show I turn to my wife and say this is so well written and so well acted. Just an amazing show, really.

I want to say a couple of things. As a kid who had a severe learning disability, the idea that I could make a career out of writing, I think surprises most of my teachers. The idea that the writing and the execution of the show, the acting spoke to you and resonated with someone who’s had so much success in the mental health field. That’s a really cool bar that I was hoping we could hit. I’ve lost a friend to suicide and nothing will bring him back, but knowing that his story has helped other people means he didn’t die in vain.

I’m not a mental health expert, certainly not now, but I’m more aware of things. There are these silver linings that happen around trauma and the idea that I know you because of that show, that this relationship started a couple of weeks ago and continues today. The other relationships like that I’ve had and Alicia, who said that the show saved her life. There are people who I’ve met and I want that for him and I want that for me.

It’s amazing. I mean, such an amazing story. For those who have been around people who have taken their own lives and been through that experience, it is such a painful ripple effect that just touches so many different people. I work with a lot of college kids and I often think, unfortunately, you’ll hear about a story where this happens on a particular campus. I often think about, “What about all of those other kids on that campus? What about all of those kids that even if they didn’t know that person, they’re a contemporary of that person?”

Just the fact that it’s so permanent and so many kids out there are struggling that I cannot help but wonder when they see. I just rewatched the first show, when they say, “I won’t spoil it for my readers.” When they see Rome in the middle of taking an overdose and then so beautifully written, but so amazing that he didn’t tell anybody. He didn’t tell anybody for a bit/ To hold that, it just makes you think like how many people out there.

We got to be at least able to wreck the pilot, but we’re also not going to have any to talk about, but I do love the fact that your head is blocking it, so it looks like it says Mali’s Ward. I started a stand-up comic, so I’m going to try to put some.

I hear you. It’s all points up here.

The show came from this idea. The only thing I knew about the show at first was wouldn’t it be interesting if one friend is about to take his life when he gets a call from a second friend that a third friend took his life? Just the idea that a suicide prevented a suicide. I thought, “That’s really interesting.” I do nothing about who they were, what they were going through, why they were in this crisis, what was going on.

I just thought, That’s an interesting cold open.” This is the writing side of this. I just spent time trying to figure out like, “Why would someone be suffering?” I really wanted it not to be that people were suffering for financial reasons or at least that wasn’t the most apparent thing. If you watch the show later in the series, you discover that when Rome was going to take his life, it was the same day he got a Super Bowl ad. He was a commercial and this is a huge day in his career. I think part of what he was feeling was like, “If even today, I feel like this, am I ever going to get out of it?”

That process of finding different stories and finding different hurts really allowed me to base characters on different parts of my hurt and really cathartic. The director of the pilot, James Griffiths, who did just a beautiful job, pointed out that he’s like, “You have four characters on the show.” If I go back and look at it  like, “That’s true.” It made it then easy to write because I could hide it. If my pain was hidden in a Korean American woman, you might not suspect it’s me.

Finding different stories and different hurts allows a person to understand all kinds of pain. Share on X

Interesting. I didn’t know that backdrop, so I appreciate it you sharing that. I also say I’ve never seen a show where I’ve uttered the words to my wife at the end of every episode. “How about one more?”

Just to people who are reading, backs out at two a day. It’s a lot. Especially the first season.

Talking About Your Pain

You’re going to start, clear your schedule. It’s an amazing show. I want to just touch on something. The whole reason I created Normalize It Forward is I wanted to have an open dialogue with people about mental and you just said something so fascinating. I think with depression, a lot of people misunderstand what depression is. A lot of people misunderstand what it looks like and what it feels like.

Many people, especially men, let’s face it, we walk around with our masks on all day long and we’re hiding it and we’re hiding how we feel. It’s certainly not, I would say, an open acceptance for men to cry open. I always joke when I ask a male in my office, “When was the last time you cried?” They’re like, “Three years ago.” I ask a female and they’re like, “Maybe 30 minutes ago.”

In the elevator.

The way in here.

“I’m crying right now.”

It’s just that’s the world we live in. I think that as a result, especially for men, it is so hard to deal with those emotions that come up. I think that really for my readers to understand, especially parents of young people, that those emotions may be there and they might be hidden and they might not be talked about. Someone looks at you and says, “DJ, how are you doing?” You’re like, “I’m fine.” It’s a classic answer. “I’m fine. I’m good.”

Rome’s hiding it.

Right.

Just to speak to that, because if you have parents listing, I try to break this habit every second of parenting is to solve and to fix. When you have a teen who is dealing with depression, just knowing that it’s a safe space to say, “I am hurting,” is huge. It doesn’t mean you have to solve the hurt, but just knowing that I can tell you I’m hurting and you’re not going to think less of me as your child. If you provide that as a parent if you go, “I just want you to know it’s okay to not be okay. I just want you to know, maybe others differ with this.”

You don’t want to burden your child, but if you want to say like, “I have hard days too. I have some friends who’ve had really hard days. Tell me about it, what’s going on.” Just to know that I can be your perfect kid that I’m trying to be with my grades and my sports and my theater, whatever it is that I’m doing to know that I don’t get demoted in your mind because I’m hurting. In the same way, I wouldn’t be demoted because I broke my arm. To know that is so big.

That’s huge, DJ. I think what a great tip for parents because I always joke I’m like, “We were given two ears. Listen to your kids. Try to hear what they’re saying when they’re not talking and paying attention and giving them that unconditional I’m here for you, no matter what you throw at me, no matter what you have to say, no matter how you’re feeling, it’s okay. It’s totally okay.”

I’m going to just wreck some episodes because I think the work we’re doing here is more important than plot stuff because even if the story, you’re still going to love it, guys. Here’s what I’ll say. One of my favorite scenes in our entire series, John died by suicide in the pilot. His daughter Sophie is struggling, A, because she lost her dad, and B, because in the series she becomes a survivor of sexual assault. She’s hurting. She finds out that there’s another student who was assaulted, and she wants to meet that student but then she finds out that the student died by suicide.

The fact that the same thing happened to Sophie that happened to this young woman and the fact that this woman died by suicide, the way her dad did, really makes her start to spiral and wonder, “Is this my fate? Is this my destiny in a Star Wars way?” There’s a lot to carry. She goes to Rome, who almost took his life in a pilot, and who everyone is aware of the story. probably because of their dynamics of Rome stepping up as her surrogate dad in a lot of ways. She may not have felt like I could talk to you about your dark days, but she’s really curious. This is the scene.

She knocks on his door and he’s delightfully surprised but surprised to see her there. He’s trying to figure out as we all would, if our teenage kids and friends show up at her house, “What’s going on.” “I need to ask you something.” “Anything, whatever.” She says, “What made you think you wanted to do it?” He suddenly realizes, “We’re talking about this.” As much as Rome might share, he’s also aware I’m an adult sharing too, I’m aware of the power dynamic and I realize you’re not just asking for a book report, there’s something going on.

He has to be careful in how he answers. She explains what’s going on and his closing line. Romany Malco, I love you, dude. You’re probably not reading this because you have your own podcast and stuff, but for someone reading this, the next time you run into Romany, stop them and say, “I heard DJ national podcasts. He’d said he loves you for this.” He had this line that we did and he just delivered it so beautifully and he says to her at the end, and he tells her why it doesn’t necessarily mean you’ve been predisposed to some things, but that doesn’t mean and there’s help and there’s support.

We’re so much more aware and we’re talking about it as a friend group in a way that John and we didn’t do that. You’re set up to succeed. He said, “If you’re ever feeling that way, don’t knock on my door.” The audience for a moment, I’m sure you were like, “What did you say?” He goes, you knocked my door down. That is the thing. To anyone who’s struggling and reading, anybody who’s like, I’ve struggled and listen, I don’t know about the listening part, but I’ve struggled and I’ve been in pain.

I’ve been in pain so great that I think I cannot bear this pain. I have helped people who have been in pain that is so great, they cannot bear this pain. You call someone and you tell them what you’re feeling. If you need to call 998, that’s cool. These people have been trained to that. They are honored to be there. If you need to tell a teacher, if you can tell your parent, if you can tell your sibling, if you can tell a friend, just tell someone. The mere process of telling someone will make you feel not alone.

If someone cannot bear the pain they are facing, call them and relate to their pain. Share on X

Just amazing advice.

For a standup comedian for sure. I’m sure Jack gets given out that advice. Jim, are you giving out that advice?

I think that it’s such a strange place for a young person to be when they’re feeling that way. As a therapist, I realize it doesn’t go from today, Tuesday, everything’s great, tomorrow, Wednesday, everything’s s***. It’s a slow decline. There’s a lot of opportunity, as you said, to reach out to someone and to take that leap and to say, “I don’t even know how to say this, but I feel awful and I don’t even know what it is.” It doesn’t have to come off as eloquent. It doesn’t have to even be said. If you want as a young person to text an adult, do it. Doesn’t matter. As you said, DJ, once you take that step to tell somebody now you’re not alone, you’ve also created a safety net for yourself. I think the concern of self-harm does decrease as a result of that.

Before we say, one more thing I want to say. Anytime I talk to a mental health specialist when I’m on a podcast or on a panel, I ask this question. I know how you’re going to answer, even though you haven’t answered, which is asking someone if they’re thinking about hurting themselves, does that make them more inclined to hurt themselves?

No, it doesn’t. I think that whenever I’ve done it, and I’ve done it a lot to assess safety, it is ten times out of ten received well by the person because the message is this person cares. This person cares enough to ask me, “Have you been thinking about hurting yourself? Is this something that you’ve considered? Do you have a plan?” It doesn’t make a person think about it more because quite frankly, they’re already thinking about it a whole bunch.

There are three groups of people. Some people weren’t thinking about it, who you ask, and they’re like, “What? No.” They brush it off because they weren’t thinking about it. Some people were thinking about it and were hoping someone would ask, that’s who you desperately want to get to. Some people are thinking about it and didn’t think it showed. The mere fact that you’ve given them a safe space to feel that way is everything.

Absolutely. I consider myself really lucky. In my office, in my space, I create that environment for young people. Over my 25 years of doing this, obviously, technology has developed as well, but I’ve developed more ability to see people online. There are times when I’ll see a student and they’re in their room at the University of Alaska somewhere and far off and they’re able to share this stuff. I’ve had plenty of kids over the years look at me and say, “I’ve never told anybody this.” That to me is an honor for them to share that. It’s amazing.

With that, there’s a school in my area and they have had four suicides in the last two years. It’s just tragic. I mean, like it guts me. To the other parents that I actually did a podcast, one of my podcasts was How to Talk to Your Kids About This. Are you thinking of like I had Dr. Barbara Van Dahlen, who was my consultant on the show, she talked about it. If you’re in a situation where someone has taken their life and you’re worried about your friend or your child or your partner, whomever, that is the perfect opportunity to talk about it because it’s on the table.

“How are you doing? How does this make you feel? Have you ever thought about that?” Talking about it and is unbelievably helpful. I haven’t been doing this as you have, but I certainly have been surrounded by suicide a lot in the last six years. I’ve never found someone was like, “How dare you talk to me about this?” I’ve only met people who, especially with the pandemic, everyone is dying to connect. If you look at someone and you notice them and they’re seen, people appreciate being seen.

Isn’t that interesting? Of all the people you’ve talked to, not one person has responded poorly. Think about that. That’s, that’s really interesting to me.

I’ve called someone to go like, “Look, maybe it’s because I lost my friend because I’m doing the show, but that last call I’m just a little worried. Are you okay?” I’ve used like you can say, “I heard a podcast and the guy said, I should do like, use me as the excuse, use you as the excuse.” Whatever the thing is that is so much better than the feeling I had when I was supposed to have lunch with my friend the next week and he took his life. I wasn’t aware he was suffering. I would want no one to be in that situation ever.

Providing The Right Support

Glad you said that because DJ, I don’t know how old your kids are, but a lot of parents as they approach pubescent years, they’re nervous to talk about sex and body parts and this and the other thing. I talk about everything because I do it in my office, but suicide is one of those topics that’s so hard for parents to talk about sometimes. I love how you said that. I think it’s so accurate. If a person recognizes, “I’m going to be temporarily anxious about throwing this word out of safety or suicide or depression,” that is nothing compared to losing a significant other, a child, a friend, or anybody else. Not even close.

“I know high school is tough even all these years later, I remember it. If you’re ever feeling down in a way that you need to talk about, know that I’m here to listen.” You can move on. You can. You can do that as you’re dropping off laundry. Like that’s okay, but you set the table for it. I have walked with, I do the American Foundation for Suicide Prevention Walk. I’m doing it Saturday. I have walked with a thousand people.

On Saturday, will get together at a park in Pasadena, California, and every single one of them will have been touched by suicide directly. There were different beads and necklaces, and the colors of the necklaces meant I lost a child to suicide, or I lost a parent to suicide. Green means you’ve had an attempt or you yourself are struggling. You meet all these people and you realize you’re not alone. It’s a group you would never want to belong to, but they couldn’t be more welcoming. To parents out there, I don’t want you walking for your kid. If you are walking for your kid, don’t walk alone.

I did the walk last year here in Southern Connecticut and had the exact same response and really powerful. Met some amazing people. All of what you just said, all of those messages are so 100% true for everybody. Parents out there, I mean, really listen, really heed our advice. We’ve been around it. We’ve been through it. DJ lost a close friend. I’m sure this show brought many people and their stories right to your world. I can only say this. One of the things that made me so happy when I started this podcast just a few months ago is I got an email from a mom and she said to me, “I listened to your show in the car with my 15-year-old and it allowed me to talk about hard topics.” I’m like, done. That is the reason I have this bad guess.

An Episode On Suicide

Can I tell you a similar? That story, you affected a certain amount of people and that happened like to use your platform in that way. I lost my friend to suicide. I was just writing my story and then I found that we, me and the other writers were telling all of our stories. I think it’s the middle of season one, Delilah finally gets this blue envelope. Spoiler, if you’re wondering what happens to her, but she gets the blue envelope. John’s suicide note is there. I was very purposeful because of the great advice I got from Dr. B, our consultant, that a person who dies doesn’t get to speak from the dead.

I had to be really careful because you don’t want to send a message that you can kill yourself and still be part of life because you cannot, you’re dead. I knew I had this one note and Ron Livingston who played John was very generous enough to do the note. There’s a whole backstory there, but we don’t have time for it. He spent a lot of time on this note and the episode aired and it coincidentally aired the day I was finished with the season writing. I actually had a lot more time.

I got an email from our publicity person saying, “You’re about to get an email I’m forwarding to you. It’s really sensitive. Just want to make sure you’re in a good head space when you read it.” I’m bracing myself and it’s from a mom and she had lost her son to suicide 37 days before, a month, and a week before. She had watched our show and then her son took his life. She stopped watching and then she returned to the show because she was hoping watching the friends grieve the loss of John would help give her closure. The letter was heartbreaking. It was like a parent’s worst nightmare. She wanted a copy of our note, which is a note that I wrote.

Dr. Barber reviewed, this is fictional, it’s not real, like, it’s not real people. I love that people felt they were real, but they’re not. I called Dr. Barber and I was like, “This mom, like she needs, she’s hurting.” She said, “I’ll tell you what to do. You should call the American Foundation for Suicide Prevention. They have local chapters and the people meet regionally.” I called up and this is the part where, because the season was over, I had some time. I was like, I don’t want to give this woman a phone number. I want to give her a name. I called up, and I was like, “I’m DJ Nash. I have a show on ABC called A Million Little Things.” She said, “I know exactly who you are. The kid who struck out a kickball was super cool.” Also, it meant the mental health community.

Sounds funny these days.

The mental health community had supported the show and of course, so it was great. She said, “What’s going on?” I told her and she said, “Can you call me back in five minutes?” I called her back five minutes later. She put me in touch with a mom who had lost her son to suicide seven years before. Those two women had coffee on me. If our show did nothing else but bring those two moms together. It was enough. Even all these years later, the picture of the two of them at coffee was on the wall of the writer’s room for the remainder of the series. It’s on my phone under my favorites. Unexpected gift.

Worrying Stats On Young People

That’s amazing. Look, there are people out there that are hurting. Suicide is such a hard topic. You and I can talk about it for hours and hours. I think there are many stories of people that have unfortunately been touched by it. Let me ask you this, DJ, because I work with a lot of young people and I try to ask this question at each of my podcasts because I’m always curious about your viewpoint, a big question, but the statistics for young people, they’re bad. They’re not good. The amount of anxiety, the amount of depression, the amount of suicidal behavior in attempts.

Suicide is now the second leading cause of death in young people and that’s reported. It’s probably more like the first. That’s grown in the last 10 years. It used to be number twelve, but now it’s number two. Obviously, there is a tremendous amount more stress and a lot more laid-up things for young people. I’m curious when you think about that and you put yourself in the shoes of a young person, whether high school or college. What are your thoughts? What advice would you offer to a young person who’s hurt?

That’s a really good question. I’m comfortable enough on this to tell you that I probably should have made it out of high school. It’s only by the grace of God that I’m here. What would I tell myself then is really your question. Tell someone. Ideally, someone who can hear it. Here’s what I would tell them. There’s this famous story, I’m sure it, the guy who jumped and survived the jump off the bridge. I’m going to get the statistics of the numbers wrong, but they’re close enough, of a hundred people who jumped off the Golden Gate Bridge, 10% survived and 100% of them as soon as they jumped wish they hadn’t jumped. It will pass.

If you are hurting, tell someone who will listen. Share on X

There is no question that it hurts. It hurts so bad. It feels like no one cares and it feels like it won’t end. I talked to my dear buddy, Gary Gulman, who is a hilarious stand-up comedy. Gary’s amazing and he went through a lot. He did the special The Great Depression and I remember he said this because my son and I came to watch his show. He said, “I wish I could tell myself if I could tell 15-year-old me that one day someone I’m so sexually attracted to is going to walk by me naked in the bedroom, but I’m going to be so busy reading my book that I don’t even look up.”

It really is like is this going to matter in five minutes? Is this going to matter in a year? Is this going to matter? Like all of that stuff, it passes, which doesn’t mean it’s not going to get shitty again, but then it’s going to pass again. As you live in Connecticut, it’s that weather. There are sunny days, there are rainy days, there are snow days. There are unexpected days where you bring an umbrella and it’s a clear day and days where you don’t and it pours, but it passes. There is more good than there’s bad.

Listen, I so appreciate your honesty. I don’t know if you realize this or not, but by sharing what you share even about you, you connect with people out there. You let people know that they’re not alone. You let people know that beyond cliches, you let people know that are listening to this and watching this, that what they’re experiencing is not unique. As a matter of fact, statistically, it’s actually the majority of young people that are experiencing shitty things, anxiety, depression, you name it. Your thoughts on this, DJ, are so appreciated. I just want you to know, it means a lot. It means a lot for people to hear you talk so openly and honestly about this, really does.

Pandemic Effect

I appreciate that. I have found this incredible community. During the pandemic, that triggers depression, loneliness, fear of health, isolation, money issues, or any of those things. I heard this from the Surgeon General, because I was on this committee with all these like, had to go to the special kid, sixth grade English class kid was on a committee with the Surgeon General, and he said, “Every one of these issues is exacerbated by the pandemic.” We have teens and we had eight year old like my kids who we were afraid we were going to die.

It wasn’t lava. It wasn’t like the boogie man. It wasn’t something that you could go like, “You just saw that movie Sixth Sense and it scared you.” Like this was real s***. Like where I’m at. We didn’t know. “There are so many people dying. They couldn’t hold them in. There were driveways and garage.” What is normally an unjustifiable anxiety was a very justifiable anxiety. You don’t just turn that off. That’s still there. My kids lost two years of education. They’re smart kids though. Now maybe I won’t see dumb so soon in their life, but they also lost two years of social skills and two years of interacting and navigating fights and flirting with people and whatever those things are.

All of it.

One thing I always ask people when I speak somewhere, I just did it this week, I asked, “Who’s a good friend?”I say, “Show of hands, who’s a good friend?” Pretty much everyone raises their hand. Who’s a good friend of themselves? You get like half. Why not? First of all, you should be a good friend of yourself only because your friends need you as a friend.

 

 

That’s right. It’s a huge point. The other thing that I noticed in spades during COVID was certainly all that loss, but there was a point where our hope of future things was like teeter tottering. We weren’t hopeful anymore. Kids weren’t sure what six months from now or a year from now was going to look like. Thankfully, a lot of that’s been restored. To your point, I think that when we all went through that, I think the majority of people were feeling those depressive symptoms. I think the majority of people were feeling cooped up and anxious and isolated and maybe even a little angry at not being able to do things. Since then, there have been a lot of individuals who have still continued on that path.

It’s very easy to say, “I’m not going to go to that party.” It’s easy to skip something because we were justified before.

That’s right. Those patterns, whether it’s adults or whether it’s young kids, those patterns continue. To me, I love what you said about being a good friend to yourself and really just being good to yourself. We as human beings, we need to socialize. We as human beings, we need to do certain things to stay healthy. Our doctors remind us of that all the time. As you said, we can blow those things off or we can do those things, but really stopping and thinking about what puts a smile on my face, that’s where it’s at.

I’ll admit to you, because of being a showrunner and running a show and writing some other things and being a dad and a husband and all of these, I say to them like, “They’re all burdens. They’re all delightful opportunities I have and places I spend my time but because they’re all there, I always feel like I’m letting someone down and doing something.” In order for me to go out to dinner with a friend, that friend usually needs to either be another writer because I want to ask them about this idea or they need a favor.

The amount of times I’ve gone out to dinner with a friend because I wanted to go and I needed a night for myself. Why am I not doing that? Those moments where you fill your own bucket and you recharge, we have to do that. That’s usually my New Year’s resolution to myself to live life the way I want to, not the way I ought to, but like why aren’t we doing those things and we have those opportunities?

This is like ridiculously silly and stupid. If somebody is reading to this, it meets me one day, you can say to me, “How are your feet?” I don’t just put cream on my feet before I put my socks on. I was like, “I don’t want to have cracked feet. I’m doing this.” What does it take? Thirty-five seconds to really lotion those feet. Every day now I lotion my feet. I’m like, “You’re doing this for you, buddy. They can wait.” Just a simple task of like, I’m putting lotion on my feet before the sock.

You heard it guys. Anyone who meets DJ, ask them about his feet.

Ask me. Let’s see those. Are they cracked? If your heels are cracked, man, you’re not a good friend to yourself.

It’s funny. You referenced Gary before. I still laugh. He has so many funny things, but I still laugh when he goes through his JCC stick.

You never know, Gary. You never know. We know, Mom. We know.

Just hysterical.

Behind The Scenes Of The Show

That’s a phrase we say around the house, you never know, Gary. Certain things have come from my friends like I have a bunch of friends who are really successful comics who kept doing it. Gary’s one of them, like, “You never know, Gary. You never know.” I want to ask you this because you were so generous, truly, a million things as a show you liked. What storyline in particular spoke to you?

There were so many. There were so many. I think that in the first show, that scene that I described with Rome really spoke to me, I think as a male, and just that sense of when’s he going to tell people like what happened. That resonated with me a lot. Forgive me, I cannot remember all of the characters’ names.

It’s okay. Either can.

As a therapist when she was sick.

Maggie.

Yeah, it really resonated because we’re human beings too. We’re taking on lots of issues that come our way in our office but there’s there’s s*** that comes up for us too all the time. It spoke to me around the concept of really everybody should be seeing somebody at some point in their world and dealing with their own issues. Gary’s character, I don’t know what I could say. I mean, loved Gary’s character, just amazing. An amazing human being. The surprise factor of his sarcasm and then his mix between that and his care and concern for people was just awesome.

Just to tell you two quick stories. When I met with James, James Roday Rodriguez played Gary beautifully. I had talked to his agent and he’s like, “You got to meet James and I will tell you candidly, I had never watched Psych. I knew his face and I just didn’t know him. Honestly, as was true of all the characters, all the actors, I didn’t care how you were in something else, I care how you are in this. I knew that Gary was like the key because if he can deliver a joke, we have a series. If he cannot, it’s just really sad.

It’s just a sad sack of s***. I said to his agent, he’s going to have to read with me. He’s like, “He’ll read.” I’m like, “I know, but he’s a big actor. I just need you to tell him ahead of time. I don’t want it to be awkward.” “He’ll read.” He comes into this meeting. He’s wearing gym shorts and a T-shirt that definitely he didn’t pull out of the drawer today.

He’s wearing black socks and sliders. I remember the name of the sliders because he bought me a pair because I referenced this a lot. I go into those, “James is here. I walk out to meet him, bring him back.” I’m like, “Okay.” Not sending a signal that he wants this gig. Like, “Are those your best sliders?” They were by the way. He came back and he said, “I read the script. I really loved it.” That’s very kind. I could tell it affected him. I said, “That’s really nice.” I told him the story. I had this friend and I was in a bad place myself. I was really feeling down.

I was walking one day at lunch, just psych myself up to go back to work in the afternoon. I ran into a buddy of mine and he was also in a bad place, but we both lit up. I’m like, “Dude, we should have lunch.” It wasn’t like a LABS thing, we meant it. He said, “I’m really busy this week. How about next week?” I’m like, “Yes, but we’re doing it.” He killed himself. James looks at me and he goes,” He really didn’t want to have lunch with you, did he?” Unbelievable. It is as inappropriate as it is funny.

That sounds like it’s Gary.

It’s Gary. I said to him, “Dude, if you can do that because I’m going to write you that but if you can deliver that, we have a series.” The daughter’s playing guitar for her dad. If she plays something by Bruno Mars, I’m going to burn this place down. It became this really fun thing because James and I, this talking to him many times a week is probably the thing about the show I miss the most because I just love him. I was pretty much a stickler that we need to get it as written. You can surprise me with alternate takes, but I need it as written.

One week I was watching the daily, I’m watching a cut. The editor assembles, the director’s cut, the director does a quick pass and then I’m looking at what the show is that we’re making. It’s the episode where it’s Theo’s birthday. I think it’s that Gary leaves the party because he has to go give the dog back or something like that, something in that vein. As he leaves this kid’s birthday party, by the door are the goodie bags, which someone from Props just put, in because you’d have that there. It’s never in the script.

It was not like the people on our crew were so attentive that that’s a detail they had it. He just grabs three bags and leaves, which obviously is going to cause a problem because you have exactly as many as the guy. He needed three good and plenties or whatever. It was so funny. I call him up like, “Dude, that’s incredible.” We were doing an episode, and I’ll be vague because I don’t want to wreck stuff, but there’s a point in the series where Gary’s going through some really rough stuff and he just doesn’t want to be treated differently.

He really doesn’t want to be treated differently. He yells at the whole friend group in a loving way because it’s his turn because we sometimes do that. The group disperses to someone broke a glass, someone goes to clean it up, and now he’s alone with his good buddy, Rome. Gary’s been battling breast cancer for the last 18 months of his life and Rome’s been battling depression. They have two guys with diseases. Gary shares that he’s scared, that when you beat cancer, you don’t believe you’ll beat it forever, you think I’d beat it until the next screening.

A lot of stuff that he said in the pilot has come back for him. Rome says and he’s yelled at everyone, “Do not treat me differently. I don’t want to be treated differently.” Rome says, “This is not me treating you differently.” He gives Gary a hug, which is like two bros hugging in a show. It’s an earned moment. Like I directed the episode and we started with Romany’s coverage, meaning the camera is on Rome’s face. We’re shooting over Gary’s back to Rome’s face and he hugs and we’re in the scene. I don’t yell cut because I think maybe something magical will happen.

It doesn’t. I yell cut and I think they even joke like DJ just wants his hug in as long as possible or something like that. I yell cut and I had often did this. I did it a lot in the pilot and I can tell moments, but I sometimes change things and only tell one actor. The courtesy I do is I tell the other actor something’s different this time, stay in it. I said that to Romany and I pulled James aside. I love both these guys can like, you give them a joke, they’ll hit it out of the park. I said, “James, next take, I’m not going to yell cut. When you feel it’s right, say this.”

I whispered in his ear and he’s like, “Okay.” We do the scene. I’m really scared, Rome says, this is not me treating you differently. He gives his friend a hug and we stay in it, like we’re in it. On Rome’s coverage, you hear Gary say to him, “Correct me if I’m wrong, but did your penis just touch my penis?” Everyone on set, I go, “Cut, that’s awesome.” We’re not using that. We’re totally using it. That’s what friends are. Like that’s what you do. I had the great pleasure, like the privilege. I knew what the finale of our series was going to be when I pitched the pilot.

I just knew the story and I kept it from a lot of people along the way. I let people in who needed to know because it affected how they were playing certain parts. I said to James, “Do you want to write the finale with me?” He was like, “Dude, you already know what it is.” I’m like, “I do but we’re going to make it better if we write it together.” He was like, “I only want to write it with you if it turns out exactly the way you want it to.” I’m like, “Me too.” That’s exactly what I want to, “Great.” I’m so glad we got that cleared up.

We wrote this finale together and 85% of it is stuff I knew. 15%, the things that you would point out and go, “I love that moment,” James wrote. It was so fun to do it together because he had to do a lot of things physically as an actor to get ready for the finale. I was directing the finale. We were both in the backseat as Rome and Eddie were doing that scene about where we were going to get the drugs. Those two dudes who are really funny were never funnier than in that. It was so funny. “That’s my girl. Why is she your girl?”

The honor of working with twelve actors who were even kinder off-camera than their characters were on camera. If I asked them to show up, like Allison who played Maggie, and James who played Gary, we were done with Maggie’s wig. I said, “Let’s fly and give it to a woman with breast cancer.” They did, we flew and we gave. I asked them to show up to a mental health thing. “Yeah, where are we going?” Even after the series ended, Romany flew halfway across the country to do it. As you watch our series, and I hope you do, they are as kind as you hope they are. Every single one of them.

I can only say I’ve met Stephanie.

Stephanie is great, who plays Delilah.

If they’re half as kind as her, I get it. These are special human beings and your show was beyond amazing. I could sit and say to you and blow smoke at you. It meant a lot to me because of the topics. I think that it gives people the opportunity to talk about things that they’re not talking about. I think that one show after the next, there’s something you can take from every show. It could be a bit about a character, it could be a bit about a topic.

I often find myself saying to parents have you asked your kids what it’s like to be a high schooler now? Have those conversations because these are topics that you wrote about in your show and these are topics that are happening in real life in people’s worlds and they’re not getting talked about. I thank you, number one, for bringing the show to the public. It’s a gift for everybody. Again, if you haven’t seen it, please watch it. It’s amazing.

Make sure you’re watching it, the pilot. Make sure you’re watching the pilot when you’re in a good place.

I agree.

There’s a suicide in the pilot. Make sure you’re taking care of yourself. Any episodes that are particularly, potentially triggering have warnings in front of them. That first episode is a lot.

I appreciate you saying that it is. It can be triggering. I totally agree with what you’re saying. Again, the topics, amazing. The actors and actresses, amazing. I think taking this next step and having this conversation and really letting parents out there now and letting young adults out there now, just how important all of these conversations can be at times they’re life-changing, they’re life-saving.

Trina from Give an Hour, who Stephanie introduced me to, I recently interviewed, she used the phrase suicide protection, and I like that. I think that’s a good phrase. I think suicide protection is all about being there and asking a hard question if you need to to a friend. As a guy, if you got to throw a bro in there to do it, I don’t give a shit. Throw a bro in there. “Bro, how you doing? What’s up? You okay? Like I’m concerned about you.” Ask the question.

I don’t know whether we have to wrap up or what.

We got time.

The year before I had a pilot that did not go to series and I actually think it paved the way for me and little things, if I hadn’t done that pilot, I wouldn’t have been able to make them in little things and we can get into that if you want. The reason I’m mentioning that is when you have a pilot that is finished but hasn’t been decided on yet by the network, it’s like in pilot purgatory. You’re not supposed to show it to anyone. In fact, there’s this like a famous story of a network president finding out that someone showed the pilot and so then they didn’t pick up the pilot out of spite.

The year before I had a pilot that I really believed in. It was actually the storyline between Rome and Walter in the last season that was primarily based on this series. Anyway, I didn’t show it to people and then the pilot didn’t go forward and I was like, “I don’t want to pull all my friends together for a failed pilot. That’s super sad.” When A Million Little Things was in pilot purgatory, I said to eight couples that I’m really friends with, some of whom influenced the relationships on the show, I said, “I have a home movie I want to show you.

Do you want to come over and see it?” Eighteen people, my wife and I and our eight couples, sat in our living room and we watched the pilot to A Million Little Things. When the pilot was over, the women got up and started talking. The men just sat there. I remember so clearly, my friend, I won’t say his name for privacy purposes, or he’s probably so vain, he wants me to say, you want me to. Anyway, he said, “I feel like that all the time, and I’ve never told anyone.” We just sat there and he was like, so when I pitched the show, there was a concern with women watch it.

When we tested the show, not a single woman dropped out, and the reason they didn’t drop out is as said in the testing was, he gave us a chance to see a side of men we don’t normally get to see. I think for my friend, it was like, you’re being honest about feelings we have that we haven’t really shared. When their friend dies, it is just the kick in the pants that the group needs to finally be honest about things that are going on. Their friend’s death becomes this catalyst. This is not a show about one friend dying. A Million Little Things is a series about seven friends finally living.

I love that. In putting together, your intro, A Million Little Things pushed us to reconsider how we treat each other.

You wrote that, right?

I did not write that.

 

 

Where is that?

Google wrote that. I don’t know who wrote that. I grabbed it from somewhere on the internet.

I was like, that’s not my normal bio, but I love it.

That is your show. That’s the gift. I think the gift of us all remembering how important that is because there’s always something else to run to. There’s always something else to choose to do, but nothing should be more important than the safety of anybody we know. Sometimes it’s just spending a few extra minutes. Sometimes it’s putting cream on our feet and making ourselves comfortable but just really and truly recognizing, “Just because I’m happy today doesn’t mean other people are.” If I truly care about other people, I better let them know that.

You may not have the chance. I don’t want to be in that negative place of it could change tomorrow, but it could change tomorrow. Some people have said they didn’t take their life because someone said hi to them as they were walking by. I say hi to everybody. It’s really a problem. My wife’s like, “Come on, stop. We got to go places.” That’s a real thing.

If you are in a negative place now, never lose the chance that it could change tomorrow. Share on X

I think it’s just an immensely powerful message. I’m hoping people walk away after reading this, remembering that at least for a few days, hopefully longer but really realizing in our daily travels, sometimes all it takes is a hello.

That is Gary’s, I don’t want to wreck for the pilot, but Gary’s big speeches. We’re going to do this for three weeks and then we’re going to be back doing the same shit we always do. That is the challenge that he puts to the group. That’s the challenge you’re putting to us.

Episode Wrap-up

Thank you for the gift, DJ. Honestly, it was amazing. I’m so excited to see your next show. I know they’re in development and I know you’ll let us know when they’re out. Certainly, I’m a huge fan. I know many people out there are huge fans of your work and certainly a million little things and everything it brought to us. Thank you. I really appreciate it.

Amazing, thank you but have people check out the show and, I don’t know if you did this, I have a podcast with little stories and we often went through episodes as it’s happening. They’re numbered so you can follow along.

I listened to your two shows with Gary. It was fantastic.

Gary, I love that dude.

Fantastic.

People can reach me through the website too if they want to reach out with a question or an idea or something like that.

What’s your website?

AMillionLittleStories.com. There’s a place to ask DJ a question, I think. My assistant is very good about getting it to me right away. I’m very bad about responding right away, but I do respond all the time. I’ve met some incredible people through it.

Look, you walk the walk and talk the talk and you put yourself out there. You’re a helper, you’re a kind person and you’re a human being. Thank you for all of those things. Thank you for your time.

Thank you, Brad. This was fun. It was cool to get different questions. I like it.

If I’m ever out in California, I’ll call you, we’ll have dinner just because.

Let’s do it. I don’t know about dinner because that’s like usually family time and I have to put my cream out.

Lunch.

Yeah, good lunch. I’m a good lunch guy.

Sounds good. Thanks again, DJ.

You will. If you see Stephanie before I do, tell her I love her.

I will. I definitely will. Thanks again.

Stephanie’s probably listening.

She might be. You never know.

Bye.

See you, DJ. Thanks.

Bye-bye.

 

Important Links

• DJ Nash – website
• DJ Nash’s email address
• Instagram – DJ Nash
• X – DJ Nash